Agora

Yay! Today is a day of happy tidings. From Politiken today:

Turkish Mediation in Prophet Crisis given the Brush-off

The Turkish Foreign minister suggests to the EU that they tighten their laws against offending religious sensibilites. Both the Danish and the Dutch Foreign Minister rejects the proposal.
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UPDATE: Today is a day of happy tidings. See this post.

MFs and crapola. You’ll have to excuse my language but it’s prophane times we live in. This just in:

BT, March 11, 2006

Turkey urges European Union to examine its legislation
The Turkish Foreign Minister to be a broker between the Islamic and the European countries.

Turkey asks the European Union to examine its legislation in order to avoid conflicts between the Moslem and Western world similar to what was seen in connection with the Muhammed-crisis.

So a draft of Turkish Foreign Minister Abdullah Gül’s speech to be delivered at a convention of Foreign Ministers of the European Union at Salzburg today says.
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Ah fuck! On top of everything else today, now this:

UPDATE: Transcript of interview with Foreign Commissioner of EU at the bottom of this post. Looks ominous.
UPDATE: Time to do the Dhimmi dance. Turkish Foreign Minister to urge European nations to “examine their legislation!”
UPDATE: Today is a day of happy tidings. See this post.

Jyllands-Posten, March 10, 2006

EU-Ministers considering Arab demands

It may no longer be enough to just combat discrimination, a presentation document at meeting of EU-ministers says.

As a pendant to the Muhammed-affair, the Foreign Ministers of the EU are considering complying with Arab demands to “fight defamation of religion.”

So far the EU has voted against these kinds of proposals at meetings of the UN General Assembly, but they are now considering reversing that. So a written presentation document aiming at bettering the relations between Europe and the Islamic countries.
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The Danish site ytringsfrihed.org which leads a campaign to collect signatures in support of Freedom of Speech was hacked yesterday. The site released this statement:

Ytringsfrihed.org hacked

Some may have been surprised if they visited our site February 27 between 12.30 and 13.00.

This site was defaced and a picture of Muhammed - what the hackers named the image - was put in its stead.

It’s now the 4th time (in less than a week) that Ytringsfrihed.org has been under attack and this time the hackers succeded in placing a picture of Muhammed on the site. The picture was not hosted on our server but on a portal called sunniport.com.

We would like to stress that the signatures themselves aren’t hosted on the main site, but are located on another server. Therefore the names of those who have signed have not been compromised. Noone but we have that information.

The hackers - from Turkey - seem to think that Freedom of Speech isn’t something to cherish. Or at least, they do not agree with us. One might be tempted to think that they do not want us to express our thoughts and beliefs - but that only they have that right….

We would like to praise the hackers for finding such a beautiful ‘prayer rug’. Very beautiful calligraphy. Unfortunately we don’t understand the writing, so we would be pleased if anyone might help us translate it.

Support this initiative. Sign their petition today.

Read more about this from:

The Washington Times

Michelle Malkin’s post about her attack on February 23 - also Turk hackers.

Michelle Malkin summarizing some of the Cyber Jihadists’ attacks.

And her first post on the subject.

So, to revisit events, what happened was that Information on the Morning of Friday February 24 published an article containing among other quotes, these:

"The Danish government ought quickly to announce that Denmark does not accept denigration of the Prophet Muhammed such as the cartoons in Jyllands-Posten gives voice to. Denmark should apologize for what’s happened and make it clear that the Danish government wants nothing to do with the cartoons." So says Namik Tan, official spokesman of Abdullah Gül, foreign minister of Turkey.
[…]
"This issue is not about Freedom of Speech. This is no different than if these cartoons had anti-semitic content. If Denmark persists in insisting that this is about Freedom of Speech, it will be very difficult to proceed," Tan is quoted as saying.

The Danish government responds harshly in parliament while frantically trying to get some sort of clarification or verification of these.

Jens Rohde, spokesman for the PM:

"The Danish government can under no circumstances apologize for the actions of a private newspaper," Jens Rohde is quoted as saying to Ritzau.

"This doesn’t exactly make them more qualified to be mediators - nor does it help them qualify to be members of the EU, to be frank," Jens Rohde says of the Turkish statement.

The Turkish government backpedals big time, the spokesman quoted in Information saying he was "misquoted":

The spokesman Tan, however, negated the quote referred to him:

"I said nothing of the kind in my written statements. In fact, anyone would be sure to know that Turkey would not adopt such an attitude towards the issue at hand."

Notice the weaseling going on here. How about his oral statements? Is this man going to claim that oral sex isn’t really sex like Clinton did? That would be funny.

Later in the day, Abdullah Gül, FM of Turkey says this to a DR reporter:

He could say that: "Definitely there is a freedom press in my country. But at the same time we are not happy with these cartoons. We are not happy to see that these cartoons are insulting to others. So the freedom of press doesn’t mean that insulting to others’ identity or religion."

So this man is supposed to mediate for us? That might be fine if he was the pope and anti-Danish statements weren’t leaking from his Ministry like spunk from a freshly fucked goat (no relation, I’m sure).

On with the story, the Ambassador to Denmark of Turkey on Deadline, a Danish news program, says of the Turkish position on a Danish apology:

The Turkish government does not wish to revisit this aspect of the question. And we think that we should be looking into the future, we should be trying to find ways and means to defuse the crisis and should exert all our efforts in that direction.

[…]

We think that we… I think that my answer is clear. We think we should just look at the ways to defuse this crisis right now and move on in that direction. I think it is quite obvious.

Pressed by the host, the Ambassador says this:

No, I am saying that we have never made such a request. We did not make a request.

No you didn’t, the government would have known about such a request immediately. But a ‘high-ranking official’ of yours - in fact as high ranking as they get below the level of ministers - leaked that you think Denmark should apologize. And when you were confronted with this, you didn’t deny it. You did the weasel-dance. Evaded responsibility. Watching that ambassador evade the question may be the most lying show I have seen since the Clinton tapes.

In conclusion, since Information has yet to accept that they ‘misquoted’ Tan the Spokesman, I am going to assume that they quoted the spokesman correctly. I think there is only one possible conclusion to this; that Turkey really does consider a Danish apology to be something they owe to Moslem countries around the world; that Turkey is playing this issue low-key because they do not want to get caught like a rock between a rock and a hard place; and that a considerable group in the Turkish Foreign Ministry has no sense of what to say and what not to say. The SPOKESMAN of the Turkish Foreign Minister ought to be able to know what it is proper to say to the press.

This whole affair has been handled horribly by the Turkish Foreign Ministry. Apart from the fact that this should never have been leaked, for Abullah Gül to go on the air and give fatherly advice to Anders Fogh Rasmussen is a reversal of roles the like of which I have not seen for some time. And it only acts to spread uncertainty about the true position of Turkey - and that just after uncertainty has already been spread.

Turkey claims to be a secular democracy and yet they persecute the brave Kurds and imprison people who say that the Young Turks committed a genocide against the Armenians, when in fact they did. For us to ask them to ‘mediate’ for us would be folly in the extreme. They can mediate for us when a Turkish journalist shouldn’t worry about imprisonment with no chance of habeas corpus if they even mention the atrocities committed in the name of Turkey. Sure, the Turks are probably better than the Iraqis at upholding basic human rights, but that isn’t exactly saying a lot. We should stop treating these people like equal partners when the only place they are the equals of us is on the Soccer field. And we should send them a note asking them to please shut up.

And when Turkey applies for membership of the EU, we ought to show them off the premises in a brisk and efficient manner. These are not the kind of people we want completely open borders with. These are Slick Willies by the boatload.

I think that the fact that the Turks have so far vacillated speaks volumes of the importance of being firm with the Islamists. The Turkish Ambassador was after all one of the people who started the cartoon protests. Turkey was the only country we might expect any vacillating from, and when we stood firm, they broke. Now that we are having fits of ‘initiatives’ and such things, the Turks are yet again trying to play us.

This is a transcript of a segment by the Danish Deadline news program on DR. Link to Deadline homepage. This link will go dead after a week. To get to the segment I am transcribing, choose "fredag 24. feb. 2006"  in the drop-down menu on the right, then 22:30 in the box on the left. Then press the first link from the top to view the program and go to the timestamp indicated below.

It is indicated by DK when I translate from Danish

[02:45 into Deadline]

HOST[DK]: Turkey offers to help settle the conflict between Denmark and the Islamic World. But what is the position of Turkey on the prophet crisis? Is an apology from Anders Fogh Rasmussen needed? What is the position of the Turkish government? I have asked the recently appointed Turkish Ambassador to Denmark following a day of conflicting signals from Ankara.

VOICE[DK]: First a spokesman for the Turkish Minister of Foreign Affairs said to the newspaper Information today that Denmark must apologize for the insult to the prophet Muhammed by Jyllands-Posten.

TEXT ON SCREEN[DK]: Denmark should apologize for what has happened and make it clear that the Danish government distances itself from the cartoons.

VOICE[DK]: The statement in the newspaper caused the Danish government to contact Turkey in order to get a clarification.

ANDERS FOGH RASMUSSEN[DK]: I have been informed that the Turkish government has denied making public any statement calling for the Danish government to apologize.

VOICE: Later today the Turkish Minister of Foreign Affairs suggested that the Danish PM might say this:

ABDULLAH GÜL: He could say that: "Definitely there is a freedom press in my country. But at the same time we are not happy with these cartoons. We are not happy to see that these cartoons are insulting to others. So the freedom of press doesn’t mean that insulting to others’ identity or religion."

HOST: Welcome Mr. Akat. You are the Turkish ambassador to Denmark. Now there were a story in the Danish papers today that your Foreign Ministry wants an apology from the Danish government. Then there were new statements from Ankara. Now, can you explain to me: Does the Turkish government want a apology from the Danish government?

AKAT: Well, I also saw that news in the press this morning. And in the afternoon our spokesman from the Foreign Ministry made an announcement saying that he was misquoted and that we did not make such a demand.

HOST: But I am not asking you what the spokesperson said. I’m asking you: Does the Turkish government want an apology from the Danish government?

AKAT: The Turkish government does not wish to revisit this aspect of the question. And we think that we should be looking into the future, we should be trying to find ways and means to defuse the crisis and should exert all our efforts in that direction.

HOST: But you say you want to move beyond this question. That’s not really answering. Does the government of Turkey think that it would be constructive if the Danish government issued an apology?

AKAT: We think that we… I think that my answer is clear. We think we should just look at the ways to defuse this crisis right now and move on in that direction. I think it is quite obvious.

HOST: Mr. Ambassador, I think you understand that this is important to me. The question is… You don’t want tonight to say whether or not the Turkish government says that an apology would be in its place? Is that correct? You don’t want to answer that tonight?

AKAT: No, I am saying that we have never made such a request. We did not make a request.

HOST: Now, in the future, how would the Turkish government react to other governments demanding an apology from the Danish government - say, the Syrian government, the Saudi-Arabian government… How would the Turkish government comment on such a request?

AKAT: Well, I think we have made our position quite clear on this matter. We’ve had our Prime Minister, our Foreign Minister make statements. We’ve all talked many times that - yes - the caricatures have.. has offended the Moslem world. But on the other hand we have, we do not also condone the violence that has erupted in protestations against these. So, it is now in the interests of all to.. to find ways and mean to.. to defuse the crisis… and also trying to find strategies and educational approaches in the prevention of the recurrence of such incidents.

HOST: But, but, Turkey is also saying it would like to help, as you’re saying here, would like to find ways and means to go forward. One of those of course would have to be to address the governments who are asking the Danish government for a formal apology, for instance in the OIC, where, the all-Arab organization, Moslem organization, where Turkey has a seat. Now, how would you react to other governments who would still like an apology from the Danish government?

AKAT: Well, I can only talk, of course, for my own government. And I think that we, we have to dwell on, now as to how we.. what we must do, what kind of measures we must adopt for the prevention of these incidents happening again. Because it’s very important that we take the right lessons from this incident and go on from there.

HOST: And there is of course the suggestion that Turkey assumes some sort of role as a mediator. What exactly does that entail in your mind?

AKAT: Well, our Foreign Minister has been invited to a meeting of.. an inof.. an unofficial meeting of the European Union Foreign Ministers on the 11th and 2nd.. 11th and 12th of March where he will be able to discuss with his colleagues what we can do; perhaps our views on this matter. And only after that, I think, our role can be defined. First of all, there has to be a.. a.. willingness on the part of the European Union and the related parties for us to do something about this issue [HOST tries to interrupt] We have to discuss it with them and it is too early at this stage to what kind of a role we can play, but it is sure that we would like to play a constructive role if that role is given to us.

HOST: The Danish government has not been exactly jubilant about this, they haven’t really welcomed this in open arms, they’ve been rather reluctant. How do you read that?

AKAT: We have to see what happens on the meeting on the 12th and 3rd of March, because maybe the European Union countries will come to a decision all together in asking - or not asking - Turkey what to do. But I think that we.. I think that most people think that we have a constructive role to play, because we are the co-sponsor of the Alliance of Civilizations, an initiative that was last year initiated by the United Nations’ Secretary General and we co-chair it with the Spanish Prime Minister, and also there is a high-level group.. there of wise men which also a Turkish Minister of State co-chairs and there is a meeting tomorrow in Doha of this high-level group. Now, it will be.. we will be able to see what kind of… let’s say.. thinking comes out of that meeting as well. So we’ll be able to see what’s going around in that context as well.

HOST: Mr. Ambassador, thank you very much for coming.

AKAT: You’re welcome.

[10:17]

I’ve just watched an interview with the Turkish ambassador to Denmark on Danish TV. I’ll try to get a transcript up and provide some commentary. So far, main points: Information, the Danish newspaper that first printed the story has yet to say that the Turkish spokesman didn’t say what he was quoted for. Zaman quotes the spokesman as saying:

The spokesman Tan, however, negated the quote referred to him:

 

"I said nothing of the kind in my written statements. In fact, anyone would be sure to know that Turkey would not adopt such an attitude towards the issue at hand."

You’ll forgive me for not interpreting that as he didn’t say it. You’ll see, when I get the transcript online that something similar is going on with the ambassador. So what have we got? A government in Turkey that explicitly does not deny that any such thing was said and which does not punish those who say such things, even though they are spokesmen of the Turkish government. Fishy. Anyway, update to come.

UPDATE: Recap and analysis of the latest events in this story here.

Translators note: The Danish text uses the weasel word "dementeret" which I have translated as withdrawn. It might also mean deny, but if that is what they mean, why didn’t they say it? We’ll have to wait for an English newssource to see which word is used; Did Turkey initially demand an apology and then withdraw it, did the reporter from Information get it wrong or was this a probe to see how the Danish government would respond? It’s also interesting to note that the Danish government wants nothing to do with Turkey as a mediator now. Maybe they didn’t like their kind of mediation?

Jyllands-Posten, February 24, 2006

No Turkish demand for apology

Turkey has not joined the countries demanding an apology for the Muhammed cartoons, PM Anders Fogh Rasmussen is quoted as saying. The Danish newspaper Information quoted a spokesman from the Turkish Foreign Ministry as saying there would be no progress unless an apology was given insted of insisting that they are a matter of Freedom of Speech.

"According to my information the Turkish government has withdrawn the request for an apology," says the PM.

Following this statement, Per Stig Møller insisted that Turkey would have no special position as a mediator in the conflict, as proposed by some.

"Turkey will, as an applicant country, be present at the informal meeting of Foreign Ministers on March 11 and 12. In connection with that I have proposed to the Turkish Foreign Minister that he raise the matter there," Per Stig Møller says as he notes the special relationship Turkey has with both the European and Arab world.

LATEST UPDATE: Recap and analysis of the latest events in this story here.

UPDATE: Turkey does the weaseldance - the quoted article below is no more accurate

Politiken, February 24, 2006

Turkey Demands Danish Apology

Turkey demands official Danish apology for the Muhammed cartoons. Jens Rohde, the political spokesman for the ruling Liberal Party thinks the demand hurts Turkey’s chances of EU membership.

The Danish government must distance itself from the Muhammed cartoons published in Jyllands-Posten and make an apology.

Otherwise, no bridge-building with the Islamic world is possible, says the official spokesman of the Turkish Foreign Ministry following the European Unions’ request for Turkey to act as a mediator.

"The Danish government ought quickly to announce that Denmark does not accept denigration of the Prophet Muhammed such as the cartoons in Jyllands-Posten gives voice to. Denmark should apologize for what’s happened and make it clear that the Danish government wants nothing to do with the cartoons." So says Namik Tan, official spokesman of Abdullah Gül, foreign minister of Turkey.

Not about Freedom of Speech

He underlines that in the opinion of the Turkish government the cartoons have nothing to do with Freedom of Speech.

"This issue is not about Freedom of Speech. This is no different than if these cartoons had anti-semitic content. If Denmark persists in insisting that this is about Freedom of Speech, it will be very difficult to proceed," Tan is quoted as saying.

Long way to the EU

The spokesman of the Liberal ruling party, Jens Rohde, condemns the statement, saying that this will only make it more difficult for Turkey to act as a mediator and it will not be helpful if they want to be accepted into the EU.

"The Danish government can under no circumstances apologize for the actions of a private newspaper," Jens Rohde is quoted as saying to Ritzau.

"This doesn’t exactly make them more qualified to be mediators - nor does it help them qualify to be members of the EU, to be frank," Jens Rohde says of the Turkish statement.